Scratch

supermattyb11 · 2011-01-03 17:20:57

I know how hard it is to learn Scratch. It took me (I'm a slow learner) a month to catch on. A month! That's too long! And plus: with Scratch 2.0, more and more blocks will be coming to Scratch. That's too hard for a new Scratcher. How can you solve this? I thought of Scratch Levels, a simple learning tool for Scratch. Here's how it works:
When you download Scratch, you will have an option for Scratch Levels to turn it on or off. If you click on, you will be able to select your level. When you advance, popups will appear with explanations for the blocks.

1: You never used Scratch before. Minimal amount of blocks until you decide to move on a little bit
2: You know the basics of the basics. More and more blocks appear here.
3: You are advancing and are experimenting more and more.
4: The final level; you are almost there and the concept is really in your head.

After that, you're ready for all of the blocks in Scratch. You are now able to experiment fully with blocks.

With every advancing level, you get more and more blocks. This way, my slow-leaning self (if I was just starting Scratch) would be able to pick it up (w/o getting intimidated by the many, many blocks) in less than a week.

To answer questions:
Yes, you would have an OPTION whether or not you want to use Scratch Levels. So, you are not limiting new Scratchers.
It is just for LEARNING Scratch, kinda like a tutorial, but Scratch style big_smile

If you are using Levels, you would switch up to a higher level whenever you feel you mastered the blocks in your level. So say you are a beginner, and you have used or understood all the blocks, you can switch to Starter. Then, once you've mastered Starter, you'd go to Advanced, and so on. It will probably take the average starter about fifteen minutes. (rough guess)

If you switch to a new level, blocks would have a small icon showing it is a new block to the level.

If you are on Beginner, and you download a project with advanced blocks, then the advanced blocks will appear. The user will just not know yet how to use them.

Here is where you could access Levels.

Post questions, comments, and ideas in the forum thread. Thx all!
-supermattyb11

Last edited by supermattyb11 (2011-01-15 20:53:27)

Nexstudent · 2011-01-03 17:30:30

This wouldn't work out correctly. All blocks are required to make a full project.

cheddargirl · 2011-01-03 18:10:26

supermattyb11 wrote:
Nexstudent wrote:
This wouldn't work out correctly. All blocks are required to make a full project.
THIS IS FOR LEARNING SCRATCH! IT SAYS IT RIGHT THERE!

Whoa, calm down, we're just trying to give input on the idea.

Nexstudent does pose an interesting problem, so I don't think it's practical to prevent access to blocks based on level. Aside from that, people learn at different paces - maybe someone might learn variables faster than learning how to use sensor blocks, for example.

I do, however, think that there are different learning curves in learning Scratch (for example, those familiar with programming language are likely to learn Scratch faster than those who are approaching a programming language for the first time). I'm not exactly sure if the method proposed above will work, but I do like the idea of maybe having a tutorial that allows to have someone learn Scratch little by little by introducing blocks one at a time. smile

soupoftomato · 2011-01-03 18:15:03

Variables are easy, you master those way before anything an expert can do.

Expert would be like quality 1s1s. To few levels, and advanced people would know every block even.

JSO · 2011-01-03 18:47:52

I think I agree with cheddargirl and nextstudent. When learning Scratch, you should have the freedom to pick a block you're interested in and see what it does. What's complicated or easy, isn't the same for everyone.

It would certainly be good to make it easier to get started with Scratch. Some tutorials on all blocks would be good...

Chrischb · 2011-01-03 18:49:22

It feels like limiting yourself in my opinion... just because some blocks are too complicated for newer users to understand doesn't mean they should be hidden.

But then again, if there's an on/off option it wouldn't be too bad; it would highlight easier blocks to learn. hmm

Jonathanpb · 2011-01-03 21:06:03

Wouldn't Scratchers learn better if they had all the blocks available from the beginning? That way they could see all that you could do instead of just a bit. hmm

scmb1 · 2011-01-03 21:52:43

Hmm... I can see how Levels might make Scratch less intimidating for new users, but it could also be inhibiting. I mean, if you never saw the more "Advanced" blocks, how would you know they're available. I don't know, but I think I'm going to have to disagree with this idea. smile

supermattyb11 · 2011-01-16 17:02:09

JSO wrote:
I think I agree with cheddargirl and nextstudent. When learning Scratch, you should have the freedom to pick a block you're interested in and see what it does. What's complicated or easy, isn't the same for everyone.

It would certainly be good to make it easier to get started with Scratch. Some tutorials on all blocks would be good...

Yes, that's why you have the option to turn it off or on. smile

supermattyb11 · 2011-01-16 17:05:35

scmb1 wrote:
Hmm... I can see how Levels might make Scratch less intimidating for new users, but it could also be inhibiting. I mean, if you never saw the more "Advanced" blocks, how would you know they're available. I don't know, but I think I'm going to have to disagree with this idea.

You would know they're available because you'd switch to a higher level if you want to master more blocks. You'd advance and you will quickly discover all the blocks. big_smile

supermattyb11 · 2011-01-16 17:06:52

Jonathanpb wrote:
Wouldn't Scratchers learn better if they had all the blocks available from the beginning? That way they could see all that you could do instead of just a bit.

Maybe it could show you all you can master before you start the Levels program and then you would begin Scratch Levels. :\

supermattyb11 · 2011-01-16 17:11:46

Chrischb wrote:
It feels like limiting yourself in my opinion... just because some blocks are too complicated for newer users to understand doesn't mean they should be hidden.

But then again, if there's an on/off option it wouldn't be too bad; it would highlight easier blocks to learn.

Yes, and plus the "Levels" thing would only be for maybe the first one or two days of using Scratch. It would have steps of learning Scratch, leading up to all of the blocks to try out.

supermattyb11 · 2011-01-16 17:14:16

JSO wrote:
I think I agree with cheddargirl and nextstudent. When learning Scratch, you should have the freedom to pick a block you're interested in and see what it does. What's complicated or easy, isn't the same for everyone.

It would certainly be good to make it easier to get started with Scratch. Some tutorials on all blocks would be good...

Yes, that's why there'd be an option to turn Levels on or off. smile If you feel like you're a quick learner, then you'd turn it off. But if you want to concept Scratch quicker, you can have it "on."

kayybee · 2011-01-16 18:04:56

What happens if you download a project using like "mod" and you're on basic?

Will it appear? Or will it not? If it won't appear, and they try to play the game? Will the game work as original?

Explain.

Also, what if someone downloaded scratch that was an expert at C++, flash, java... but didn't know about the levels? What if they opened it and said "this thing is for 3 year olds" because there were only basic blocks... Then they wouldn't suggest scratch because they didn't know about levels...

supermattyb11 · 2011-01-17 11:25:23

kayybee wrote:
What happens if you download a project using like "mod" and you're on basic?

Will it appear? Or will it not? If it won't appear, and they try to play the game? Will the game work as original?

Explain.

Also, what if someone downloaded scratch that was an expert at C++, flash, java... but didn't know about the levels? What if they opened it and said "this thing is for 3 year olds" because there were only basic blocks... Then they wouldn't suggest scratch because they didn't know about levels...

Quoting myself:

supermattyb11 wrote:
If you are on Beginner, and you download a project with advanced blocks, then the advanced blocks will appear. The user will just not know yet how to use them.

Also, someone on such a low level like beginner would probably not yet know about remixing. If they did, then they would be a level better than 1. ;D

kayybee · 2011-01-17 12:16:51

Actually, many people who are beginners are the ones who download projects the most (and many of the time, just upload... but let's not get into that)

People would say "DOWNLOAD FOR BEST QUALITY" like most projects do, a new scratcher comes up, comments "how do you download" gets a response "click the button above the project notes" then downloads the project. Just cause they can download doesn't make them automatically know more blocks. Then when they open it, they see a ton of blocks they don't know, and then doesn't that defeat the purpose of the levels giving them a little bit at a time? (BTW, all you do is right click and select your block, and you can learn one in less than a minute...)

And what about the second paragraph's problem?

The immersion technique is much better than spoon feeding people. The immersion technique is how people learn. Throw them in the water, they can find their way back.

Harakou · 2011-01-17 14:40:47

I think the main problem here is that overall, most Scratch blocks (except some of the mathematical operators) aren't all that complicated or hard to understand. The hard part is learning the best way to utilize them. Besides, I'm worried that some people may start off at the first tier and then never try to advance further.

higejolly · 2011-01-17 19:52:04

Harakou wrote:
I think the main problem here is that overall, most Scratch blocks (except some of the mathematical operators) aren't all that complicated or hard to understand. The hard part is learning the best way to utilize them. Besides, I'm worried that some people may start off at the first tier and then never try to advance further.

Same here.

nich117 · 2011-03-15 13:20:30

It sounds good, but if u right click a block nd click help it explains how to use it. Like kayybee said i think it is better just to let them explore on thier own, because the thing is that when u limit people then their projects are limited to. Its better for them to ask around then to be only use these blocks kinda thing. If they dont know what the block does they wont use it, but eventually from downloading other's projects or using the "help" option they will get how to use stuff and then their projects will be more advanced. Basically the barriers are already there just in peoples heads not phisicaly on scratch.

archmage · 2011-03-15 13:29:32

kayybee wrote:
Also, what if someone downloaded scratch that was an expert at C++, flash, java... but didn't know about the levels? What if they opened it and said "this thing is for 3 year olds" because there were only basic blocks... Then they wouldn't suggest scratch because they didn't know about levels...

Every block in Scratch is super basic already. What if they opened it and said "this thing is for 3 year olds"... well it is clearly for younger people but that isn't really a bad thing. I think by implementing this feature it will stop a person's growth by making it seem like they can only use a set amount of blocks. Also what may be simple to one person may not be simple to another.

Scratch

archived forums

#1 2011-01-03 17:20:57

Scratch Levels

#2 2011-01-03 17:30:30

Re: Scratch Levels

#3 2011-01-03 18:10:26

Re: Scratch Levels

supermattyb11 wrote:

Nexstudent wrote:

#4 2011-01-03 18:15:03

Re: Scratch Levels

#5 2011-01-03 18:47:52

Re: Scratch Levels

#6 2011-01-03 18:49:22

Re: Scratch Levels

#7 2011-01-03 21:06:03

Re: Scratch Levels

#8 2011-01-03 21:52:43

Re: Scratch Levels

#9 2011-01-16 17:02:09

Re: Scratch Levels

JSO wrote:

#10 2011-01-16 17:05:35

Re: Scratch Levels

scmb1 wrote:

#11 2011-01-16 17:06:52

Re: Scratch Levels

Jonathanpb wrote:

#12 2011-01-16 17:11:46

Re: Scratch Levels

Chrischb wrote:

#13 2011-01-16 17:14:16

Re: Scratch Levels

JSO wrote:

#14 2011-01-16 18:04:56

Re: Scratch Levels

#15 2011-01-17 11:25:23

Re: Scratch Levels

kayybee wrote:

supermattyb11 wrote:

#16 2011-01-17 12:16:51

Re: Scratch Levels

#17 2011-01-17 14:40:47

Re: Scratch Levels

#18 2011-01-17 19:52:04

Re: Scratch Levels

Harakou wrote:

#19 2011-03-15 13:20:30

Re: Scratch Levels

#20 2011-03-15 13:29:32

Re: Scratch Levels

kayybee wrote:

Board footer