Scratch

MabonBaladevaKain · 2010-07-27 23:49:45

Hello there. Yes I'm new to Scratch, but quite reliable when it comes to ideas.
I've messed around with several other klik-style game creation programs and the only thing that Scratch beats them at is sharing projects and the learning aspect.

I believe that Scratch should stick to its strength and really make an impact by taking it to the next level. Here's the idea:

Allow Scratch 2.0 users to work on projects DIRECTLY with eachother through an online capability, so that many can work on the same project at the same time and see every block of code that they each add in. This would be the absolute BEST way to TEACH and LEARN coding skills as it happens instantaneously and you can see it happen. There should be a view that includes everyone, so you see when new stuff gets added, and there should be the capability of seperate views as well, so you can follow a single person's screen and see things like the creation of a sprite or the specific addition of code.

And within the view where you can follow a person's screen, there should be an option where you can help while viewing them. For example, one person is drawing a sprite, and you are watching them do so, but you notice their drawing doesn't look right for whatever reason, perhaps the anatomy is off or the colour transition or shading or lightsource should be different. If they have the "enable follower help" button set to ON, you can fix what they messed up on. And if they have the "enable follower help" button set to OFF, then it prevents followers from messing up their drawing. And the same goes for when looking at others as they code. You'll be able to correct their work as they proceed and if they don't want the help at that particular moment, they can have the "follower help" button set to OFF.

Each member of the online group project can save their own copy of it in case they wish to make a different version of it on their own or for backup purposes.

If that's too much to handle within the actual Scratch application, then at the very least consider making a seperate drawing and animation application where everyone can work DIRECTLY with eachother as stated above. Then after the sprites and/or animations get created, have the ability to directly export/import the sprites and/or animations into Scratch for immediate use.

This could work for coding too, although it may be harder to code a project for the users of such a seperate app if you're wanting to keep it simple to code for you, as they won't know whether the code works for sure or not until loading it into Scratch.
Of course, this is ok because an experienced user is going to know what the code will do anyway. The main thing is that it allows for others to see the creation process.

Zoomreddin · 2010-07-28 00:04:10

This would be a good idea, but It would be hard for the scratch team to make it plus a person can do all the things to a project after. Then again I'm not the scratch team...

MabonBaladevaKain · 2010-07-28 00:34:15

The idea is simply to allow all of us to help eachother while we are in the midst of the creation process. How that gets done is of little concern to me.

Currently learning from eachother WHILE the creation process is happening is completely non-existant. At this point in time it goes like this; attempt to make something, ask for help, someone helps with text, attempt to make something again --> if fail, ask for help again --> if succeed move on, attempt the next part or next thing, get stuck again, ask for help, receive an answer that you don't fully understand in text again.

And while it's the best learn method available at the moment, wouldn't it be much better to learn from eachother instantaneously without all the text?

A streamlined learning process would get things done so much quicker and make things alot more fun. A picture is worth 1000 words and showing how it's done is worth 1000 explanations of how to do it.

MabonBaladevaKain · 2010-07-28 16:00:25

Ok, it's not THE ONLY thing that NEEDS added ... heh ... but it's real high on the list.
I just added that to get people's attention.
Not as high as this following suggestion though, and this should be much easier to add:

Why can't I copy a section of one sprite and paste it into another sprite? !!!!!

This is one of the mainly used capabilities of a sprite editor.
You're only downgrading your product and forcing people to use an outside sprite editor like GraphicsGale, MSpaint, or one of the huge expensive graphic suites that most kids won't have access to. MS paint sucks unless you know the shortcuts and tricks btw, and GraphicsGale most probably don't even know about.

The point is, now I'll have to import everything because of one little tiny overlook of a MAJORLY USED feature that for some strange reason does not exist in Scratch.
The only way to get around it apparently as I'm told is to export the sprites, then copy the section you want into the other one using an outside sprite editor then re--import them back into Scratch. And if I were to do that often, that adds alot more steps and time, and I might as well just use an outside sprite editor to start with.

It's a much needed feature that almost every sprite editor has and that everyone would appreciate having in Scratch 2.0.

fg123 · 2010-07-28 16:24:35

That's a good idea but I'm afraid it might cause server loads, as scratch is open source, it doesn't have the right servers to take on that kind of live project building...

coolstuff · 2010-07-28 16:26:17

I'm pretty much with fg123 - live project building could be something of a hassle for the server. It actually has been suggested, though! I think the current system of upload - download - upload - download is inadequate, but I think that's the best we're going to get.

MabonBaladevaKain · 2010-07-28 17:37:44

I guess a whole new program would need to get built for such a thing then eh?
Maybe one day someone will make it happen, whether it be in Scratch or some other game creation suite.
Until then, unless we do it ourselves, all we can do is dream i guess.

Btw, the whole not being able to copy a section of one sprite to another thing is even more ridiculous than I thought. I have the free version of GraphicsGale, which is a very nice program but it doesn't support gif's, so I used an old Jasc animation shop which worked good enough to get the job done but it was fairly time-consuming for the tiny task that needed to be done. And then when I finally get it back into Scratch, I find that the hotspot is changed, so I had to fiddle around with that too!

So I guess that's more needed than any online capability, as it's a major pain without the cut and paste a section of one sprite into another ability.

Thank You guys for all your responses.
This site is definitely one of the best, maybe THE best for response time.
I appreciate it.

coolstuff · 2010-07-28 17:41:59

Yeah - I agree with you on the Cut and Paste option. There should be a better way of doing it (at the moment, copying is more like duplicating - it doesn't copy anything to the clipboard).

MabonBaladevaKain wrote:
I guess a whole new program would need to get built for such a thing then eh?

Actually, they are rewriting Scratch from the bottom up for the next version, 2.0. They're switching entire programming languages, from Squeak/Smalltalk to Flash, so a couple bugs that have been around from the start are going to be eliminated. It promises to be awesome. Still, I don't think such online capabilities will be implemented.

MabonBaladevaKain · 2010-07-28 18:07:10

Yea, it'd be one 'eluva nice surprise for all the Scratchers out there if they did implement it though. Flash eh? ... that's too bad ... I was sorta hoping they would put some right click functionality in there. Flash is good to get projects seen though, do you know if they are planning on making the code blocks exportable into actual Flash code?

Maybe they could add some sort of mandatory Scratch 2.0 splash screen that is hard to remove if they did, that way people would know it was made in Scratch 2.0, and the Scratchers could have more freedom of transportability with their projects.
I mean, almost everyone has an Adobe Flash Viewer of some version on their computer.
Way more people than that have Java installed at least.
That way the Non-Scratchers could play the games as well.

coolstuff · 2010-07-28 20:20:08

MabonBaladevaKain wrote:
Yea, it'd be one 'eluva nice surprise for all the Scratchers out there if they did implement it though. Flash eh? ... that's too bad ... I was sorta hoping they would put some right click functionality in there. Flash is good to get projects seen though, do you know if they are planning on making the code blocks exportable into actual Flash code?

Probably not, but since it'll be running in Flash anyways, it doesn't really make much of a difference - you could embed it in other pages with the "embed" functionality already in Scratch and it would be easy to mistake Flash for Scratch.

Maybe they could add some sort of mandatory Scratch 2.0 splash screen that is hard to remove if they did, that way people would know it was made in Scratch 2.0, and the Scratchers could have more freedom of transportability with their projects.

I think embedding works just fine smile

I mean, almost everyone has an Adobe Flash Viewer of some version on their computer.
Way more people than that have Java installed at least.
That way the Non-Scratchers could play the games as well.

Absolutely! Non-Scratchers can play the games already - with the aforementioned "embed" function.

Scratch

archived forums

#1 2010-07-27 23:49:45

The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#2 2010-07-28 00:04:10

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#3 2010-07-28 00:34:15

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#4 2010-07-28 16:00:25

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#5 2010-07-28 16:24:35

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#6 2010-07-28 16:26:17

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#7 2010-07-28 17:37:44

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#8 2010-07-28 17:41:59

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

MabonBaladevaKain wrote:

#9 2010-07-28 18:07:10

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

#10 2010-07-28 20:20:08

Re: The ONLY implementation that Scratch 2.0 NEEDS besides a speed boost

MabonBaladevaKain wrote:

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