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#26 2008-01-11 16:25:59

chalkmarrow
Scratcher
Registered: 2007-05-18
Posts: 100+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

One way to do it is to make use of the dynamic nature of script fragments and place something like a "DoubleClick4Comment" broadcast block next to the stuff you want to comment on, then have a separate sprite with costumes for each comment. I modified this project to show that idea:

http://scratch.mit.edu/projects/chalkmarrow/63452

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#27 2008-01-11 18:02:08

Paddle2See
Scratch Team
Registered: 2007-10-27
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

While chalkmarrow has demonstrated an incredibly elegant commenting technique, I don't see how it substantially improves on just leaving dangling Say statements next to the script you are attempting to comment.  The first time you do a Clean Up command, all your comments are going to be mixed up.  Plus, it takes far longer to build the costumes for the comments than it does to stick some Say statements together. 

Maybe we should stop trying to come up with elegant work-arounds and see what we can do to help the Scratch team come up with a solution integrated into Scratch.  What resources do they need to expedite this issue and come up with a solution?


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#28 2008-02-17 14:28:35

bobbysq
Scratcher
Registered: 2007-06-26
Posts: 100+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

help screens (for the new blocks) weren't in 1.2 beta though. wink

Last edited by bobbysq (2008-02-17 14:29:53)


originals forever!

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#29 2008-03-14 23:13:30

realmzmaster
Scratcher
Registered: 2007-11-17
Posts: 4

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

The problem with work arounds is just that they are work arounds!. Comments should be part of any language. I cannot stress the need for comments strongly enough. I teach a college level beginning programming class for non-programmers. I used Scratch for the first five weeks. I knew from the code what the students were trying to accomplish but not their thought processes at that moment. A comment would have helped me to understand what the student was thinking. Also, we had students exchange projects with each other. The assignment was to look at the other student's project and explain what was happening. All the students immediately stated that they had problems understanding the other student's project. I had the students explain their projects to each other. Only then did the A-ha lights go off and the students were able to understand what the other student was attempting and how he/she tried to accomplish it. We used Alice for the last five weeks of the class. I taught the students how to comment the methods they used to create their worlds. The comments were an immense help to the other students and myself. Documenting code is just good programming practice. I am not saying the comment block was the best method, but it was a good method and better than nothing. I love Scratch as a beginning language. Scratch teaches the basic programming concepts very well. But , I truly believe a comment method should have been built into the initial release of the language.

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#30 2008-03-17 07:51:08

Ingoguy15
Scratcher
Registered: 2007-12-07
Posts: 20

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

I am only an amatuer, and even though I don't have much experience in anything except scratch (I have some Ruby experience) I strongly agree with comments being added. I think that we need this to happen as soon as possible, unless we have another official method. I think that the flipped block idea is the best one that can be implemented. The main point here is that comments are needed. If scratch is a "learning" language, then it should, by all means, stress the importance of comments.

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#31 2009-01-03 18:55:29

sfg
Scratcher
Registered: 2008-12-31
Posts: 11

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

about every thing like senses and stuff i don't know how tomake four targets down and it stops the animation

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#32 2009-01-03 19:51:39

Paddle2See
Scratch Team
Registered: 2007-10-27
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

sfg wrote:

about every thing like senses and stuff i don't know how tomake four targets down and it stops the animation

Please post your questions to a topic that relates to your question.  You can also create your own topics if you can't find one that lines up.  I'm sorry but I can't figure out what you are asking here...maybe you can leave a link to the project with the problem?  Sometimes that is the easiest way to get an answer.


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#33 2009-01-03 20:37:44

ihaveamac
Scratcher
Registered: 2007-09-22
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

I think this topic is outdated since 1.3 is out. I'm not saying it IS.


~ihaveamac - visit ihaveamac.net

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#34 2009-10-10 04:12:06

TheoMarr
Scratcher
Registered: 2009-04-13
Posts: 100+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

If you try to use the comment block in Scratch 1.4 it stops your creation and when you try to export a sprite with a comment block in Scratch 1.4 and open it, it errors. And, I still find the comment block very useful. Can you make a Scratch 1.4 with the comment block brought back? Just asking...

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#35 2009-10-10 05:04:17

Paddle2See
Scratch Team
Registered: 2007-10-27
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

TheoMarr wrote:

If you try to use the comment block in Scratch 1.4 it stops your creation and when you try to export a sprite with a comment block in Scratch 1.4 and open it, it errors. And, I still find the comment block very useful. Can you make a Scratch 1.4 with the comment block brought back? Just asking...

Have you tried the new "Add Comment" feature you can use in the Scripts area?  It replaces the old Comment Block.  You right-click (Alt-click if you are using a single-button mouse) in a blank area of Scripts and select "Add Comment" from the menu that pops up.  A place to enter text appears and you can type in what you want.  You can then drag the block of text over to any block and attach it to the block, if you want.  It's a cool feature  smile


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#36 2009-10-10 06:30:51

Jonathanpb
Scratcher
Registered: 2008-07-25
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

I joined when the current version of Scratch was 1.2.1. This meant that I missed the comments. I was glad when they were added in 1.3, however.

I never knew the comments used to exist until I downloaded an old game. The game wouldn't go! I had to remove the comments from the scripts so I could play. After a long time, I got it ready. I was going to save the Scratch project so I wouldn't have to go through all the work again, but I remembered that there was some Emulator text! I don't have Emulator, so when I save, it would become a different font (that did not fit the project)! So I had to fake the Emulator text and delete the real text... but it was worth it!

It seems quite silly to insert scripts in scripts... I much prefer what we have now.  smile

Last edited by Jonathanpb (2009-10-10 06:31:33)


"Human beings... must have action; and they will make it if they cannot find it.
-Charlotte Brontë

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#37 2009-10-11 17:07:49

coka
Scratcher
Registered: 2007-11-03
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

Jonathanpb wrote:

I joined when the current version of Scratch was 1.2.1. This meant that I missed the comments. I was glad when they were added in 1.3, however.

I never knew the comments used to exist until I downloaded an old game. The game wouldn't go! I had to remove the comments from the scripts so I could play. After a long time, I got it ready. I was going to save the Scratch project so I wouldn't have to go through all the work again, but I remembered that there was some Emulator text! I don't have Emulator, so when I save, it would become a different font (that did not fit the project)! So I had to fake the Emulator text and delete the real text... but it was worth it!

It seems quite silly to insert scripts in scripts... I much prefer what we have now.  smile

I believe the comment blocks were only in the beta versions of scratch before 1.0, I joined when 1.0 was out and I don't recall comment blocks.


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#38 2009-10-11 17:10:17

coolstuff
Community Moderator
Registered: 2008-03-06
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

coka wrote:

Jonathanpb wrote:

I joined when the current version of Scratch was 1.2.1. This meant that I missed the comments. I was glad when they were added in 1.3, however.

I never knew the comments used to exist until I downloaded an old game. The game wouldn't go! I had to remove the comments from the scripts so I could play. After a long time, I got it ready. I was going to save the Scratch project so I wouldn't have to go through all the work again, but I remembered that there was some Emulator text! I don't have Emulator, so when I save, it would become a different font (that did not fit the project)! So I had to fake the Emulator text and delete the real text... but it was worth it!

It seems quite silly to insert scripts in scripts... I much prefer what we have now.  smile

I believe the comment blocks were only in the beta versions of scratch before 1.0, I joined when 1.0 was out and I don't recall comment blocks.

Comment blocks were in the beta of 1.2.

I joined just after 1.2.1 was released, so I wasn't around at the era - but I first started using Scratch with 1.1, but took a year-and-a-half long break 'till February of 2008. (I realise that my join date says March, but that's always inaccurate, as I remember it was late February.

Last edited by coolstuff (2009-10-11 17:10:47)

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#39 2009-10-13 06:58:58

Jonathanpb
Scratcher
Registered: 2008-07-25
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

coolstuff wrote:

coka wrote:

Jonathanpb wrote:

I joined when the current version of Scratch was 1.2.1. This meant that I missed the comments. I was glad when they were added in 1.3, however.

I never knew the comments used to exist until I downloaded an old game. The game wouldn't go! I had to remove the comments from the scripts so I could play. After a long time, I got it ready. I was going to save the Scratch project so I wouldn't have to go through all the work again, but I remembered that there was some Emulator text! I don't have Emulator, so when I save, it would become a different font (that did not fit the project)! So I had to fake the Emulator text and delete the real text... but it was worth it!

It seems quite silly to insert scripts in scripts... I much prefer what we have now.  smile

I believe the comment blocks were only in the beta versions of scratch before 1.0, I joined when 1.0 was out and I don't recall comment blocks.

Comment blocks were in the beta of 1.2.

I joined just after 1.2.1 was released, so I wasn't around at the era - but I first started using Scratch with 1.1, but took a year-and-a-half long break 'till February of 2008. (I realise that my join date says March, but that's always inaccurate, as I remember it was late February.

The dates are wrong? Is it just the month, or what?


"Human beings... must have action; and they will make it if they cannot find it.
-Charlotte Brontë

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#40 2009-10-13 16:02:41

coolstuff
Community Moderator
Registered: 2008-03-06
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

Jonathanpb wrote:

coolstuff wrote:

coka wrote:

I believe the comment blocks were only in the beta versions of scratch before 1.0, I joined when 1.0 was out and I don't recall comment blocks.

Comment blocks were in the beta of 1.2.

I joined just after 1.2.1 was released, so I wasn't around at the era - but I first started using Scratch with 1.1, but took a year-and-a-half long break 'till February of 2008. (I realise that my join date says March, but that's always inaccurate, as I remember it was late February.

The dates are wrong? Is it just the month, or what?

Sorry, I don't understand. What dates are wrong?

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#41 2009-10-14 12:39:53

TheoMarr
Scratcher
Registered: 2009-04-13
Posts: 100+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

Jonathanpb wrote:

I joined when the current version of Scratch was 1.2.1. This meant that I missed the comments. I was glad when they were added in 1.3, however.

I never knew the comments used to exist until I downloaded an old game. The game wouldn't go! I had to remove the comments from the scripts so I could play. After a long time, I got it ready. I was going to save the Scratch project so I wouldn't have to go through all the work again, but I remembered that there was some Emulator text! I don't have Emulator, so when I save, it would become a different font (that did not fit the project)! So I had to fake the Emulator text and delete the real text... but it was worth it!

It seems quite silly to insert scripts in scripts... I much prefer what we have now.  smile

Yeah, same here

coka wrote:

I believe the comment blocks were only in the beta versions of scratch before 1.0, I joined when 1.0 was out and I don't recall comment blocks.

Then you wouldn't have bothered to get the beta of Scratch 1.2.

I only joined at the era of Scratch 1.3.1, however, since I saw a project about a hidden "say nothing" block by someone called homestarfan I have been more and more active about hacking and seeing early versions of Scratch. Eventually I saw a project about a hidden comment block so therefore now I know it exists.

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#42 2009-12-13 08:15:29

rdococ
Scratcher
Registered: 2009-10-11
Posts: 1000+

Re: Why comments are not in Scratch 1.2

andresmh wrote:

The Scratch Team decided not to include the comment block because we found it was not clear for beginners to understand what the block does.

Personally I was against that block because I felt it was not consistent with the rest of the Scratch user interface (having a different color from the block category where it was and a functionality that didn't exactly match its category either).

I also thought that commenting on code should not be a block but instead a property of a group of blocks. The metaphor of "code as blocks" seemed to break when blocks were also used for code metadata.

Given that there was a lot of discussion within the Scratch Team about this feature and we didn't want to delay the release of the new version until a satisfactory solution was implemented, we decided to get rid of that feature for now.

Hopefully the next version of Scratch can have comments. Someone in the team said "it's always easier to add a new feature than removing it". Very true.

Here is the answer from John Maloney, the lead developer of Scratch:

johnm wrote:

Q: Where's the comment block from the 1.2 beta?

A: There were some issues with the comment block design during beta test. Partly, the comment block looked so much like other blocks that some users thought it should do something and partily it was too bulky. But that first design did suggest some other commenting mechanisms (perhaps more like "postit" notes than blocks). Since we did not want to ultimately have two incompatible commenting mechanisms, we decided to remove the comment block from this release and try to create a better commenting mechanism for the next release.

Meanwhile, we've made the notes pane scrollable so, as an interim solution, you can put comments about your code there. (I know--its not as useful as being able to put comments right in the code--but it's better than nothing.)

  -- John

I got it, and i found out it was still there, did you look in the Control group of blocks?

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