Scratch

MrMokey wrote:

@DIY

First. By adding these instruments to the mix does not mean that they are officially in. By simply experimenting and seeing what sounds good does not harm anything.

From what I can see is that, taking your 'quality over quantity' into consideration, you are taking 3 roles. By having one person doing one thing really good rather than one person doing 3 things ok, it would be better to have more members.

Also, before the original post was updated I was listed as the bassist. Therefore I am not just a 'stand-in guy'.

@jjiskyline Just for further reference I do play plucked rather than bowed. I do play jazz and since I am having trouble findng some half decent tabs I will probably improvise some stuff 

I told you, if you are willing to take the risk of pitch and toss when it comes to a totally improvised piano part/whatever on a song that it is not featured on in the first place, go ahead; what I cannot guarantee, or any mixer in that case, is that it will make it into the final mix. This has happened before with Frozen Coco.

By quantity, I clearly stated we shouldn't rush the number of songs we do, just for the sake of progress; it was not an issue of how many instruments one plays. I fail to see how that applies here considering the fact that I am very much experienced in many musical instruments, many of which I'm not listed up in the roster for. We still await your audition, so you're not yet in.

I think an audition by MrMokey would settle this debate.

DIY wrote:

Wow. That was long.

I just have two things to say: Tribute bands are tribute bands and thus the reason All4one mentioned earlier that we'll do whatever it takes to come close to the sound. I do not see why we can't do so (a similar misconception was there with the other band I manage, Frozen Coco, that does our originals; people earlier thought we couldn't sound professional and were just a kid band). By ditching this view, it has resulted in much more mature song writing and polished results (we have seven releases to date with no other band here) and our work keeps getting better (you'll see in the next singles releasing soon). As an online band, of course we are restricted, and that also further limits us to being experimental and adventurous in our work; you never know how some new concept or added instrument will sound when added to the mix. We cannot and should not take that risk as it is duly not fair on the person who recorded it, thus the reason Frozen Coco are doing well. This is my view on our work ethic (again, I'm not the manager of this band, so just sharing my experience with Frozen Coco.

The second thing I'd like to say, is that management of an online band is not easy at all. It is so easy for you to say, 'a big, fat 'N/A' for quality of music because, well, for a 'band' you don't have many songs finished' which I find crude, given the fact that you've had no managing experience of an online band whatsoever. I think All4one is doing a much better job than tonnes of other bands formed here (too many have failed for e to care to count), so it is unfair to bluntly accuse he and us of no work. Seeing I had to take over mixing duties, things have become much harder as I need to juggle my work with Frozen Coco as All4one said, so progress is indeed slow. Nevertheless, we are doing great and I think this band has some talented musicians, so if you're implying anyone here is an extraordinarily good piano/guitar player or whatever, I'm sure jji and I have more than enough proficiency to handle those ourselves.

I'm not saying you're input is going to be of no help to the band, but your post did come across as harsh. I wanted to straighten things out there. Once we move onto the next singles, ideally we should be worried about them only then. Frozen Coco didn't release 'When I'm Beside You', planning what will be done for 'Early December'. I just think it makes sense here. jji and the rest of the band members (your view counts here again All4one) should be given priority over the stand-in guys, then this would be a fair group. It's a quantity vs. quality issue here. I don't think we should rush our singles just to move onto more recordings, but spend time perfecting each one, every step of the way.

May I point out that All4One, the manager of the band, agreed and kindly responded to what I said, and you are totally contradicting what he said. I am not questioning if you have authority, perhaps you do, but all I am saying is All4One who seems to have the most power in this group, took my criticism as being constructive whereas you seem to be taking it as some sort of insult.
Please, can we just come to reality for a minute? There is going to eventually be a limit as to the 'quality' of your work. Like I stated before, this is a kids' programming website, not everyone here is a Beatles loving musical expert. You will hit a barrier at some point, you cannot deny that, and working slower won't necessarily increase the overall quality. Work as slow as you want, I don't mind as I am not in the band, but... if you set your expectations too high, you are setting yourself up for disappointment. I'd say if you want musical perfection, move this project into real life or at least onto a website where music is a focus.
And yes, as a matter of fact, I am implying that some people here are extraordinarily good piano/guitar players. I can't control who you let in, but to be honest, if you think you and jji have enough 'proficiency' to handle it yourself, the DO it yourselves. Don't ask for help if you aren't going to take it.
Finally, I am extremely happy that MrMokey is being allowed to perform and if I had any say in this (which I clearly don't) I'd say go back and find all the other people you denied and give them a chance too.

As I don't want this to get all flamewar-y (I am glad so far it has been civilized, gentle debating), I still wish you good luck on this project even though I don't have high hopes for it.

wiimaster wrote:

DIY wrote:

Wow. That was long.

I just have two things to say: Tribute bands are tribute bands and thus the reason All4one mentioned earlier that we'll do whatever it takes to come close to the sound. I do not see why we can't do so (a similar misconception was there with the other band I manage, Frozen Coco, that does our originals; people earlier thought we couldn't sound professional and were just a kid band). By ditching this view, it has resulted in much more mature song writing and polished results (we have seven releases to date with no other band here) and our work keeps getting better (you'll see in the next singles releasing soon). As an online band, of course we are restricted, and that also further limits us to being experimental and adventurous in our work; you never know how some new concept or added instrument will sound when added to the mix. We cannot and should not take that risk as it is duly not fair on the person who recorded it, thus the reason Frozen Coco are doing well. This is my view on our work ethic (again, I'm not the manager of this band, so just sharing my experience with Frozen Coco.

The second thing I'd like to say, is that management of an online band is not easy at all. It is so easy for you to say, 'a big, fat 'N/A' for quality of music because, well, for a 'band' you don't have many songs finished' which I find crude, given the fact that you've had no managing experience of an online band whatsoever. I think All4one is doing a much better job than tonnes of other bands formed here (too many have failed for e to care to count), so it is unfair to bluntly accuse he and us of no work. Seeing I had to take over mixing duties, things have become much harder as I need to juggle my work with Frozen Coco as All4one said, so progress is indeed slow. Nevertheless, we are doing great and I think this band has some talented musicians, so if you're implying anyone here is an extraordinarily good piano/guitar player or whatever, I'm sure jji and I have more than enough proficiency to handle those ourselves.

I'm not saying you're input is going to be of no help to the band, but your post did come across as harsh. I wanted to straighten things out there. Once we move onto the next singles, ideally we should be worried about them only then. Frozen Coco didn't release 'When I'm Beside You', planning what will be done for 'Early December'. I just think it makes sense here. jji and the rest of the band members (your view counts here again All4one) should be given priority over the stand-in guys, then this would be a fair group. It's a quantity vs. quality issue here. I don't think we should rush our singles just to move onto more recordings, but spend time perfecting each one, every step of the way.

May I point out that All4One, the manager of the band, agreed and kindly responded to what I said, and you are totally contradicting what he said. I am not questioning if you have authority, perhaps you do, but all I am saying is All4One who seems to have the most power in this group, took my criticism as being constructive whereas you seem to be taking it as some sort of insult.
Please, can we just come to reality for a minute? There is going to eventually be a limit as to the 'quality' of your work. Like I stated before, this is a kids' programming website, not everyone here is a Beatles loving musical expert. You will hit a barrier at some point, you cannot deny that, and working slower won't necessarily increase the overall quality. Work as slow as you want, I don't mind as I am not in the band, but... if you set your expectations too high, you are setting yourself up for disappointment. I'd say if you want musical perfection, move this project into real life or at least onto a website where music is a focus.
And yes, as a matter of fact, I am implying that some people here are extraordinarily good piano/guitar players. I can't control who you let in, but to be honest, if you think you and jji have enough 'proficiency' to handle it yourself, the DO it yourselves. Don't ask for help if you aren't going to take it.
Finally, I am extremely happy that MrMokey is being allowed to perform and if I had any say in this (which I clearly don't) I'd say go back and find all the other people you denied and give them a chance too.

As I don't want this to get all flamewar-y (I am glad so far it has been civilized, gentle debating), I still wish you good luck on this project even though I don't have high hopes for it.

All4one does indeed have the most power in this group; nowhere does it say I am the manager of this band. Experience wise however, I have handled Frozen Coco's managing duties for nearly a year now and there is no question that I have more management experience over him. This definitely doesn't put me in a position of authority to out-rule him here, but it does mean I can input into the way my own band is being managed (seeing as that after a year and a quarter since its inception, Frozen Coco is still quite extraordinarily going strong). It would look kind of silly for All4one to try and defend this band's work so far as we have nothing to show and that could look like he is making excuses; I however know how ridiculously hard it can be to push a band online to record their stuff/cooperate (thankfully at least the interest is there as of all current band members). I didn't see most things you said as wrong, but the way this was phrased particularly disturbed me: 'a big, fat 'N/A...' ~ I do not think this is the recognition an online band should get for the above reasons. I actually think we've done pretty well so far, given my time spent with Frozen Coco and the others' work.

I see no reason for the quality of our work to dip over time. There is no justification for that. It's not like we will all at one point decrease in our musical skill; we will only keep learning and improving. If you're talking about the band crumbling, of course, there will inevitably be a day where it happens, perhaps even in the near future. It's not like this band is going on forever. But certainly, our musical output should never get worse. I will repeat myself about the 'kids' programming website' thing:

DIY wrote:

I do not see why we can't do so [be professional-sounding] (a similar misconception was there with the other band I manage, Frozen Coco, that does our originals; people earlier thought we couldn't sound professional and were just a kid band). By ditching this view, it has resulted in much more mature song writing and polished results (we have seven releases to date with no other band here) and our work keeps getting better.

No one can be perfect, but we can come close to it even online if we work together well (the fact that we are a cover band makes us less wild in our exploration of techniques, making the job that much easier). If we don't dip in standard, there should be no room for disappointment.

No one here even asked for another pianist or guitarist (other than bass), so jji and I can duly handle those duties ourselves. As for bass, I was before restricted to the view that it would be better to get an electric bass guitarist in order to get closer to the real sound, but I understand that if the manager's view on this is changed, we'll have to wait and see for an audition. I play bass myself, and if I really wanted to, I could take over all those duties, but I do not want to monopolise here. I do agree with you that every member of this band is a great musician. We have recorded our own instruments for the current songs ourselves and they are done, so we only await the vocals.

Lastly, I too am glad that we are able to gently debate this out. This should by no way turn into a heated debate. I have not contradicted everything above, but you can see we have our different views. I'm just stating mine, and now that an audition is taking place, I believe that will hopefully settle things here.

wiimaster wrote:

DIY wrote:

wiimaster wrote:

May I point out that All4One, the manager of the band, agreed and kindly responded to what I said, and you are totally contradicting what he said. I am not questioning if you have authority, perhaps you do, but all I am saying is All4One who seems to have the most power in this group, took my criticism as being constructive whereas you seem to be taking it as some sort of insult.
Please, can we just come to reality for a minute? There is going to eventually be a limit as to the 'quality' of your work. Like I stated before, this is a kids' programming website, not everyone here is a Beatles loving musical expert. You will hit a barrier at some point, you cannot deny that, and working slower won't necessarily increase the overall quality. Work as slow as you want, I don't mind as I am not in the band, but... if you set your expectations too high, you are setting yourself up for disappointment. I'd say if you want musical perfection, move this project into real life or at least onto a website where music is a focus.
And yes, as a matter of fact, I am implying that some people here are extraordinarily good piano/guitar players. I can't control who you let in, but to be honest, if you think you and jji have enough 'proficiency' to handle it yourself, the DO it yourselves. Don't ask for help if you aren't going to take it.
Finally, I am extremely happy that MrMokey is being allowed to perform and if I had any say in this (which I clearly don't) I'd say go back and find all the other people you denied and give them a chance too.

As I don't want this to get all flamewar-y (I am glad so far it has been civilized, gentle debating), I still wish you good luck on this project even though I don't have high hopes for it.

All4one does indeed have the most power in this group; nowhere does it say I am the manager of this band. Experience wise however, I have handled Frozen Coco's managing duties for nearly a year now and there is no question that I have more management experience over him. This definitely doesn't put me in a position of authority to out-rule him here, but it does mean I can input into the way my own band is being managed (seeing as that after a year and a quarter since its inception, Frozen Coco is still quite extraordinarily going strong). It would look kind of silly for All4one to try and defend this band's work so far as we have nothing to show and that could look like he is making excuses; I however know how ridiculously hard it can be to push a band online to record their stuff/cooperate (thankfully at least the interest is there as of all current band members). I didn't see most things you said as wrong, but the way this was phrased particularly disturbed me: 'a big, fat 'N/A...' ~ I do not think this is the recognition an online band should get for the above reasons. I actually think we've done pretty well so far, given my time spent with Frozen Coco and the others' work.

I see no reason for the quality of our work to dip over time. There is no justification for that. It's not like we will all at one point decrease in our musical skill; we will only keep learning and improving. If you're talking about the band crumbling, of course, there will inevitably be a day where it happens, perhaps even in the near future. It's not like this band is going on forever. But certainly, our musical output should never get worse. I will repeat myself about the 'kids' programming website' thing:

DIY wrote:

I do not see why we can't do so [be professional-sounding] (a similar misconception was there with the other band I manage, Frozen Coco, that does our originals; people earlier thought we couldn't sound professional and were just a kid band). By ditching this view, it has resulted in much more mature song writing and polished results (we have seven releases to date with no other band here) and our work keeps getting better.

No one can be perfect, but we can come close to it even online if we work together well (the fact that we are a cover band makes us less wild in our exploration of techniques, making the job that much easier). If we don't dip in standard, there should be no room for disappointment.

No one here even asked for another pianist or guitarist (other than bass), so jji and I can duly handle those duties ourselves. As for bass, I was before restricted to the view that it would be better to get an electric bass guitarist in order to get closer to the real sound, but I understand that if the manager's view on this is changed, we'll have to wait and see for an audition. I play bass myself, and if I really wanted to, I could take over all those duties, but I do not want to monopolise here. I do agree with you that every member of this band is a great musician. We have recorded our own instruments for the current songs ourselves and they are done, so we only await the vocals.

Lastly, I too am glad that we are able to gently debate this out. This should by no way turn into a heated debate. I have not contradicted everything above, but you can see we have our different views. I'm just stating mine, and now that an audition is taking place, I believe that will hopefully settle things here.

I'm quite sorry for 'disturbing' you. (though it seems like you are grossly over-exaggerating, I'm pretty sure what I said wasn't of much of a 'disturbing' manner)
I'm going to stop posting here, but before I go I'd like to say one last thing. Have you ever thought that there are better piano/guitar players than you out there? Wouldn't it be in your best interest to at least ask for auditions of piano and guitar in case someone extraordinarily good comes along? I'd really like to at least show my piano skills, because there is potential mine is better than your current pianist. I am unsure, because as I said before I have nothing to base it upon because you haven't done anything yet. But there is always a potential. Now when I say this, I don't mean to say that being at it for longer means I am better, but I've been playing for 10 years, that is a decent amount of time, perhaps you've been at it longer. If so, good on you. Just keep in mind if you don't ask for the help there is a potential that you are missing out on much better musicians. (By no means am I saying you are bad, I am simply saying there is a chance, and like I said before I've heard nothing from this band, so I can't judge.)
I shall leave now, please don't hesitate to notify if you ever actually want my help.
Again, good luck with this. I hope you last long enough to release something for me to listen to.
Have fun. (Please don't reply, I'm done with this, I've made my point, I'm kind of tired of you disagreeing with me when All4One has already stated that I am probably correct.)

I'm going to keep this short as you don't seem to want to talk: I see no reason for you to end this and for me not to express some of the views I have here. I've mentioned several times before, this phrase, 'a big, fat 'N/A...' does not sound close to the best advice this band could get at all. I'm not saying say good stuff about us, but not being a manager of an online band, just pause to think before you type such things...

And lol, was George Harrison the best lead guitarist ever? Of course not; he was a close friend of Eric Clapton, but why didn't the Beatles consult the latter when they had the chance? Because the line-up had been decided since the early days. Every time a 'supposedly' better pianist does come along (years mean nothing by the way, but I'll tell you I was playing classical since five and now I'm 16) we can't change the line-up for every song or whatever. Same with Frozen Coco, we do not follow such policies. I remember this propped up there too, and it's not fair to sign up later, specially seeing that my skill is more than sufficient to play 'You Never Give Me Your Money' or 'While My Guitar Gently Weeps'.

All4one said he agreed with my views too above. I told you, it's just two sides of one thing. Everyone has their different views. If you're interested in auditioning as bassist, please do, but taking over other duties is always a thing I've found frustrating.

Holy moly could you guys calm the quotes so its less of a wall of text?

^lol yeah i'm getting a bit tired of it myself. exactly, this must come to an end. i too have better things to do and since the band arrived at a consensus some posts back, hopefully this is settled.

jji7skyline wrote:

Ok, then. Are you OK with doing the Yesterday vocals?

Me? If you guys are OK with it, fine, like you said before.

jji7skyline wrote:

DIY wrote:

jji7skyline wrote:

Ok, then. Are you OK with doing the Yesterday vocals?

Me? If you guys are OK with it, fine, like you said before.

Just that I was expecting it to be mixed quite quickly, since we have all the parts now.

No way; moog effects are extremely hard to replicate, though I've got orchestral backing covered. I'll have to see what I can do with my keyboard synths.

That plus I definitely prioritise Frozen Coco's and my own solo work over this, so it won't be mixed very soon. Progress is good though.

I'd say DIY should probably do the vocals, since we agreed that he would do most of Paul's vocals.

I'd definitely agree.

Bump.

^ I thought it was cheddargirl.