Scratch

nice to see u back on at, liquid 

lights0123 wrote:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/34791551/Photo% … 9%20AM.png does this work?

yes 

bobbybee wrote:

Do you have any experience installing antidote in GreaseKit (safari)?

No, sorry. 

First off - this is pretty awesome in a lot of ways. We love to see examples of Scratchers hacking things to do cool stuff. I love that you guys just saw a need, and made a fix and then shared it.

However, I see upthread that some have raised concerns about the effects of this on moderation, and I want to mention some of my own.

* It can be problematic when the same page look radically different depending on who is viewing it. This is something we are careful of when designing the admin view of the site. If people aren't seeing the same things, things can get confusing real fast (even if they know they might have different views). One mentions 'that video' and the other is like "whut video?"  In most cases it can be sorted out, but it contributes to a kind of confusion which is bad for the user experience.  "Whats on this page" becomes "Whats on this page if you don't have x " vs. "Whats on this page if you do have x" installed.

* Mods need to move fast and be able to check out if something is or isn't kosher pretty quickly. If there are two possible views of a page, then they will probably have to view pages twice - once in each of the states. It may not seem like it takes much time to enable / disable a script, but when you multiply that times all the posts / threads mods look at every day, it adds up quick.

Lightnin wrote:

Oh and I forgot to mention, we're planning on turning images back on tomorrow. 

YAY!!
LET'S ALL CELEBRATE!!!!!

FreshStudios wrote:

Yes.. you are a life saver!

Well, not quite...

Lightnin wrote:

First off - this is pretty awesome in a lot of ways. We love to see examples of Scratchers hacking things to do cool stuff. I love that you guys just saw a need, and made a fix and then shared it.

However, I see upthread that some have raised concerns about the effects of this on moderation, and I want to mention some of my own.

* It can be problematic when the same page look radically different depending on who is viewing it. This is something we are careful of when designing the admin view of the site. If people aren't seeing the same things, things can get confusing real fast (even if they know they might have different views). One mentions 'that video' and the other is like "whut video?"  In most cases it can be sorted out, but it contributes to a kind of confusion which is bad for the user experience.  "Whats on this page" becomes "Whats on this page if you don't have x " vs. "Whats on this page if you do have x" installed.

* Mods need to move fast and be able to check out if something is or isn't kosher pretty quickly. If there are two possible views of a page, then they will probably have to view pages twice - once in each of the states. It may not seem like it takes much time to enable / disable a script, but when you multiply that times all the posts / threads mods look at every day, it adds up quick.

The first issue you have raised is very true, as we have already experienced lately. Of course, being part of the Advanced Topics community, we found a fix for it right away, and so came the signature images that told you whether you needed antidote. Of course nobody is ever sure of what the user really can see, and mods need to have every extension installed to see the potential problems.

If images are to return today, we can update our signatures and politely ask users to uninstall antidote (or update to a version where there is no img tag converting). I just want to raise a point though -- even if users keep Antidote, with your new system images that are not allowed by your white-list will not show up in Antidote either, because of how the system has been coded.

joefarebrother wrote:

coolhogs wrote:

Lightnin wrote:

Oh and I forgot to mention, we're planning on turning images back on tomorrow. 

YAY!!
LET'S ALL CELEBRATE!!!!!

        [Excess smilies removed by moderator]


(oops my computer froze - too many smilies)

HAHAHA!!!!

LS97 wrote:

Lightnin wrote:

First off - this is pretty awesome in a lot of ways. We love to see examples of Scratchers hacking things to do cool stuff. I love that you guys just saw a need, and made a fix and then shared it.

However, I see upthread that some have raised concerns about the effects of this on moderation, and I want to mention some of my own.

* It can be problematic when the same page look radically different depending on who is viewing it. This is something we are careful of when designing the admin view of the site. If people aren't seeing the same things, things can get confusing real fast (even if they know they might have different views). One mentions 'that video' and the other is like "whut video?"  In most cases it can be sorted out, but it contributes to a kind of confusion which is bad for the user experience.  "Whats on this page" becomes "Whats on this page if you don't have x " vs. "Whats on this page if you do have x" installed.

* Mods need to move fast and be able to check out if something is or isn't kosher pretty quickly. If there are two possible views of a page, then they will probably have to view pages twice - once in each of the states. It may not seem like it takes much time to enable / disable a script, but when you multiply that times all the posts / threads mods look at every day, it adds up quick.

The first issue you have raised is very true, as we have already experienced lately. Of course, being part of the Advanced Topics community, we found a fix for it right away, and so came the signature images that told you whether you needed antidote. Of course nobody is ever sure of what the user really can see, and mods need to have every extension installed to see the potential problems.

If images are to return today, we can update our signatures and politely ask users to uninstall antidote (or update to a version where there is no img tag converting).

Yep, they're on again.    Sorry it took us a while.

Thanks for being understanding about this. I think it would be good if antidote no longer parsed img tags, for the reasons described above. But inclusion of youtube videos can also be problematic. Creating a new requirement that forum mods and ST install and use this extension (and all future extensions?)  when browsing the forums doesn't seem like a good solution. The problem of having two or more possible views of the same page will likely make things complicated / confusing very quickly, even if the mod has the properly updated extensions installed.


Let me propose an alternative, and see what you all think.
Make antidote "invite only" - so that only certain, trusted / well known / whitelisted Scratchers can install it.  Use it as a way to design, test, and refine potential features - like embedding Scratch projects in posts -  that we could consider integrating with the Scratch forums for everyone's use. But keep the experimentation to clearly defined threads.

Now, I can't make any promises that features / designs tested in this way will make it into the forums for Scratch 2.0 (the Scratch Team has a very thorough design review process, with lots of people involved). But it certainly seems like a good way to experiment and demo potential features for forums 2.0. ( And by the way, here's a link to the platform / code we'll be building on: http://djangobb.org/ )

So - thoughts?

pls ignore this, im testing some way to remove tags inside of code elements...

[youtube]oHg5SJYRHA0[/youtube]
[scratch=flash]roijac/1864583[/scratch]

[youtube]oHg5SJYRHA0[/youtube]
[scratch=flash]roijac/1864583[/scratch]

some text

somebody wrote:

some text

Last edited by roijac (2012-04-16 13:32:12)

Lightnin wrote:

Yep, they're on again.    Sorry it took us a while.

Thanks for being understanding about this. I think it would be good if antidote no longer parsed img tags, for the reasons described above. But inclusion of youtube videos can also be problematic. Creating a new requirement that forum mods and ST install and use this extension (and all future extensions?)  when browsing the forums doesn't seem like a good solution. The problem of having two or more possible views of the same page will likely make things complicated / confusing very quickly, even if the mod has the properly updated extensions installed.


Let me propose an alternative, and see what you all think.
Make antidote "invite only" - so that only certain, trusted / well known / whitelisted Scratchers can install it.  Use it as a way to design, test, and refine potential features - like embedding Scratch projects in posts -  that we could consider integrating with the Scratch forums for everyone's use. But keep the experimentation to clearly defined threads.

Now, I can't make any promises that features / designs tested in this way will make it into the forums for Scratch 2.0 (the Scratch Team has a very thorough design review process, with lots of people involved). But it certainly seems like a good way to experiment and demo potential features for forums 2.0. ( And by the way, here's a link to the platform / code we'll be building on: http://djangobb.org/ )

So - thoughts?

I will discuss the issue with rookwood101 and I'm sure he will agree to remove Antidote from the "public".

This experimental version of Antidote could certainly turn out to be a productive way of trying out new features for the 2.0 forums. I will definitely be trying this out with rookwood (I already have some ideas    ) and we'll be sure to contact the team if we come up with anything interesting!

Squawkers13 wrote:

joefarebrother wrote:

coolhogs wrote:

YAY!!
LET'S ALL CELEBRATE!!!!!

        [Excess smilies removed by moderator]


(oops my computer froze - too many smilies)

HAHAHA!!!!

... It really was. It says last edited by paddle2see...