Scratch

I don't really have a strong opinion about the age limit (although the parental permission rule does discriminate against us senior citizens    ), but this discussion has brought out other things about which I do have opinions:

1.  (Most important.)  As I've been saying for years, in my role as a teacher, I would benefit tremendously from seeing a set of galleries called "projects by 8-year-olds," "projects by 9-year-olds," etc.  This would give both me and my students a sense of what level of project complexity is typical of kids of a given age.  And what I've been hearing all those years is that it can't be done because the ages of Scratchers is confidential.  But I notice that (a) y'all are perfectly comfortable posting your ages, and (b) the Scratch Team are editing out precise birthdays, but allowing ages to remain.  Oh, and (c) several non-S.T. people seem to think they know each others' ages.  So, can I push for my age gallery idea again?  Of course it would only include projects from people who opt in.

2.  By the way, quite right imho editing out precise birthdays, but I've seen quite a few "birthday card" projects...  (The problem with birthdays isn't anything about child molesters, but about the fact that nothing ever disappears from the Internet and those published birthdays will follow Scratchers into adulthood and identity theft territory.)

3.  A few middle schoolers have expressed the belief, or the hope, that they're going to have less homework in high school.  That isn't the general experience, I think, especially if you go to the kind of high school that loads you up with Advanced Placement courses.  (This isn't a disguised argument for lowering the age; just, again as a teacher, I want people to have realistic expectations about school!)  What you do get in high school, I suppose, is later bedtime to fit it all in. 

4.  This discussion pushes one of my buttons, about euphemisms.  I think a significant fraction of the heat in this thread comes from the fact that some of y'all are using the word "experience" as a euphemism for "having already seen pornography" while other people are reading it as, you know, just life experience generally, such as having been to high school.

5.  Just in the interest of accuracy, the COPPA age limit (below which U.S. web sites are restricted in what personal info they can collect, not what they can show, so it's not directly relevant to this discussion anyway) is 13, not 14.

antimonyarsenide wrote:

cheddargirl wrote:

juststickman wrote:

The thing is, if you didn't say your real age, nobody would know...

That is why the Scratch Team now requires parent's permission for those wanting to run - they want to talk to the parents to make sure they [the parents] are okay with their child taking on the role of moderator.

So, the Scratch Team is actually going to call or email our parents or something? 

antimonyarsenide wrote:

antimonyarsenide wrote:

cheddargirl wrote:

That is why the Scratch Team now requires parent's permission for those wanting to run - they want to talk to the parents to make sure they [the parents] are okay with their child taking on the role of moderator.

So, the Scratch Team is actually going to call or email our parents or something? 

Whats wrong with that?

bharvey wrote:

I don't really have a strong opinion about the age limit (although the parental permission rule does discriminate against us senior citizens    ), but this discussion has brought out other things about which I do have opinions:

1.  (Most important.)  As I've been saying for years, in my role as a teacher, I would benefit tremendously from seeing a set of galleries called "projects by 8-year-olds," "projects by 9-year-olds," etc.  This would give both me and my students a sense of what level of project complexity is typical of kids of a given age.  And what I've been hearing all those years is that it can't be done because the ages of Scratchers is confidential.  But I notice that (a) y'all are perfectly comfortable posting your ages, and (b) the Scratch Team are editing out precise birthdays, but allowing ages to remain.  Oh, and (c) several non-S.T. people seem to think they know each others' ages.  So, can I push for my age gallery idea again?  Of course it would only include projects from people who opt in.

2.  By the way, quite right imho editing out precise birthdays, but I've seen quite a few "birthday card" projects...  (The problem with birthdays isn't anything about child molesters, but about the fact that nothing ever disappears from the Internet and those published birthdays will follow Scratchers into adulthood and identity theft territory.)

3.  A few middle schoolers have expressed the belief, or the hope, that they're going to have less homework in high school.  That isn't the general experience, I think, especially if you go to the kind of high school that loads you up with Advanced Placement courses.  (This isn't a disguised argument for lowering the age; just, again as a teacher, I want people to have realistic expectations about school!)  What you do get in high school, I suppose, is later bedtime to fit it all in. 

4.  This discussion pushes one of my buttons, about euphemisms.  I think a significant fraction of the heat in this thread comes from the fact that some of y'all are using the word "experience" as a euphemism for "having already seen pornography" while other people are reading it as, you know, just life experience generally, such as having been to high school.

5.  Just in the interest of accuracy, the COPPA age limit (below which U.S. web sites are restricted in what personal info they can collect, not what they can show, so it's not directly relevant to this discussion anyway) is 13, not 14.

I like every single point you made. 

cheddargirl wrote:

antimonyarsenide wrote:

antimonyarsenide wrote:

So, the Scratch Team is actually going to call or email our parents or something? 

Not sure, I think the original intent was to have the parents contact the Scratch Team should the candidate be elected, although it could be possible being the other way around. Let me flag down a Scratch Team member so we can get a definite answer. 

My understanding is the same as yours...if a candidate between the ages of 14 and 17 is elected, they will be asked to have their parent or guardian contact the Scratch Team by phone.  The person setting up the election isn't available for a few days so I can't verify this information but that's what I recall.

fg123 wrote:

So if we get parental permission, and they verify it, but you are too young, we still cant? 

To my understanding, no, you will not be able to get moderatorship if you are underage even with parental permission.

To me what's also so harsh is how you guys say you were making this decision for months or something, even though during the time there wasn't the public's opinion...

cheddargirl wrote:

Lucario621 wrote:

To me what's also so harsh is how you guys say you were making this decision for months or something, even though during the time there wasn't the public's opinion...

What do you mean by "public's opinion"?

The community's opinion on the subject.

cheddargirl wrote:

Lucario621 wrote:

To me what's also so harsh is how you guys say you were making this decision for months or something, even though during the time there wasn't the public's opinion...

What do you mean by "public's opinion"?

I think he means, that the scratch team took months deciding an age limit, however we hardly got a say in it. i knew they were going to put an age limit, but i didn't expect it to be so high. 

Blade-Edge wrote:

This is like a car crash full of ninjas

XD lol

Blade-Edge wrote:

This is like a car crash full of ninjas

No, I don't think it's that dramatic 

So they didn't even consult the moderators until recently?
I imagine this board room with the lights off, and there are 4 shadowy figures sitting across from each other plotting things
Dun dun dun
It's the Scratch team

Last edited by Blade-Edge (2010-10-01 22:49:15)

cheddargirl wrote:

Blade-Edge wrote:

cheddargirl wrote:

What do you mean by "there wasn't the public's opinion"?

He probably means that you guys made the decision and finalized it before the community could say anything

Unfortunately, I can't answer for that because it was the Scrath Team who decided upon this rule, not us moderators. But if I had to make an assumption:

To my understanding, the Scratch Team does try to make safety one of the upmost priorities here on the website. My guess is that since this is a safety measure, it becomes more of an issue to be handled only by the Scratch Team rather than have so many young people suddenly try to sway the rule in their favor (since such a thing can be potentially destructive in this case).

spelling fail 

Last edited by ScratchReallyROCKS (2010-10-01 22:58:59)