Scratch

I like the first plan (different site). Maybe you could add a link to the site (this current one) and advertise it at the bottom of every page.

I would like to second Mayhem's suggestions - it would be very helpful if I had some control over and access to my students accounts.  Something that flagged us when our students uploaded a project or commented just so that I can see what they are up to!

nice idea but i dont like the school.scratch.mit.edu  cause everyone doesn't learn it in school and it makes it seem like this is a school thing and a lot of ppl dont like school they try to push away from that! lol i would go with e.scratch.mit.edu

I don't think that there is any way to *prevent* inappropriate posts.  What the big social networks do is to hire people to find and remove such posts.  This is expensive. 
I think that what ScratchR has been doing (asking users to inform them of inappropriate content and removing flagged items) is about as much as one can do with the resources available and still have comments on projects.

A "safe" site would probably have to block comments, require manual moderating of all account names and avatars before they appear on the site, and require viewing all costumes and scripts before programs get posted.  Inappropriate content can be pretty easily hidden in programs, so the task of "guaranteeing" a safe site seems to be nearly impossible.

The problem is to find a balance amng comfort for even the youngest kids on the site (and their parents), the difficulty and expense of monitoring the site, and how much interference there is with kids expressing themselves.

Personally, I prefer an approach where the rules are clear, the community does not support bullies and harassment, there are a few responsible people empowered to remove offending content, and the kids can easily report anything inappropriate that they find.  Pretty much the current situation.

andresmh wrote:

Mayhem: thanks for the ideas! However, even with that system, anyone could create a separate account, not connected to the teacher's account, and use it to post inappropriate content to the site. I fear it would end up making things more complex and not really preventing much. What do you think?

I agree that something like RSS feeds to track users posts and projects would be useful not only for monitoring but for everyone to keep track of our favorite Scratchers. So I see that as useful but not necessarily related to preventing inappropriate posts.

The point is not that what is postable is limited, but anyone who is logged in with a sub-account has what they can see limited, just as Natalie suggested.

Getting reports back on any problems with individuals would just be a "bonus" for the teacher.

My son is only 11, but I would prefer him to have an uncensored account.  He and I would both be annoyed if he were forced to have a censored account just becomes someone who doesn't know him thinks he's too young to accidentally hear a swear word.

I've never been fond of censorship (which occasionally makes my role as Forum Moderator difficult).

I'm with Kevin on this one, in that I would still continue to allow both my 14-year-old and 8-year old to work with the uncensored site. We really haven't had any problem with innappropriate content. In my experience, the "flag inappropriate comment" reporting mechanism works really well in getting rid of the graphically scatalogical and patently obscene stuff (judged by the "I know it when i see it" metric), and most of the other things people complain about (questionable-initial-state dress up games, unfriendly comments, etc.) aren't really a problem.

That being said, and mindful of the fact that this post hasn't really been responsive to Natalie's question (and that the problem andresmh mentioned is a real one), I think that in the context of a school class or the like, a separate site would probably be the best way to handle it. I'm not sure I would use the domain "safe.scratch.mit.edu," since by negative implication parents would consider the other site to be "unsafe." Maybe "filtered.scratch.mit.edu" or "select.scratch.mit.edu" would be more neutral.

andresmh wrote:

Mayhem: this is an example of a problem that wouldn't be solved by a "subsiduary accounts" system: http://scratch.mit.edu/forums/viewtopic.php?id=2950#p17182

Well, in fact, the victim wouldn't be able to see those messages at school, would he, as his subsidiary account (that he can also use at home) is filtered.

If he is using his own account at home and seeing things he doesn't like, that is his own responsability (or that of his parents).

But I say again, the internal reporting was just a minor "bonus", not the primary focus of my post.  The primary focus was a possible way in which to implement Natalie's suggested censored scratching access.

My preference would be for e.scratch ...

However, Middle Schoolers love slapstick violence and humor that is just over their heads - I would hate to see them blocked out of the more sophisticated offerings.

My students are pretty clear about avoiding the occasional bad words or suggestive projects that come up, but knowing the limits for violence is much harder.  Those projects aren't getting flagged as inappropriate in the same way.  It is confusing for kids that the adult's standards are so muddy.

We have a no-violence-in-projects policy in our elementary school but some students feel like home is another matter.  Because Scratch is taught at school, parents might not be aware of the need to monitor content at home. 

An experience with this now makes me feel more positive about having a younger students version of the web site.  Any "g" rated site  would have to include advanced projects and contact with older users, though--it is delightful to see a couple of my students learning a ton of advanced math from trying out what they see. 

Maybe flagging for violence, without judging if it is appropriate,  could be an option? 

Karen

Last edited by room209 (2008-02-05 22:02:48)

I understand both sides of this dilemma, but the Scratch Team, must look into their own mission and philosophy.  I first downloaded Scratch because it was said to be "away to help young people ages 8 and up develop 21st century learning skills with an easy-to-use programming tool." (~NSDL.org).  While I know this may or may not have been the original intent of the Scratch Team, it is the word that is spreading very quickly in educational circles.   

Hopefully just as any teacher should preview web content that they are about to use with their students, they should also determine the appropriateness of Scratch for their classroom. I believe if the Scratch team intends it to be student-oriented tool for 21st century classrooms, then a way to keeping out inappropriate material is their duty.

However, if it is a program meant for ALL AGES, then the Scratch team needs to articulate this in their homepage.  There are other similar applications on the web such as Stagecast Creator, but they distinctly are marketed to children and learning and to date seem to be void of this problem. 

As an educator myself, I would love a filtered or school version of Scratch, because I  at the present time the site is not appropriate for school, not just because of the violence, but because the nature of the nonacademic animations degrades educational value of the program itself.  Many students would have a hard time  using the program for the multitude of educational lessons you could implement, when they could use it to blow off heads and make red blood ooze.   

I look forward to seeing where scratch goes.

Indeed - the scratch *software* is entirely appropriate for all ages.

Some of the website content - ironically, most likely that created by younger scratchers - is not.

But as Kevin says, it would be easy enough to give a class access to scratch without giving them access to the internet.