Scratch

jvvg wrote:

werdna123 wrote:

Who even cares if Obama is a Muslim or not?

Some of the Republicans are quite racist. Them.

Anyway, like I said before, nobody should care.

And some democrats are quite racist. Citation note needed FOR BOTH.

transparent wrote:

How will it better serve the country we call home?

because then those people will be able to marry?
part of serving the country is making citizens happy!
and it's something (relatively) easy that won't cost much money!
well at least it would be easy if people weren't opposed 

Last edited by veggieman001 (2012-10-10 19:06:42)

CN12 wrote:

I have a few things that I saw in a flyer in the mail that I want to say:

Four years ago, President Obama promised to create millions of new jobs and lead to America's economic recovery.
America is still waiting.

These were from a flyer in the mail, so I didn't actually come up with it.

The economy is going to take a while to get back, but it's on track. It takes longer to fix this sort of thing than create it, and it's been being created for a while. 

stevetheipad wrote:

CN12 wrote:

I have a few things that I saw in a flyer in the mail that I want to say:

Four years ago, President Obama promised to create millions of new jobs and lead to America's economic recovery.
America is still waiting.

These were from a flyer in the mail, so I didn't actually come up with it.

The economy is going to take a while to get back, but it's on track. It takes longer to fix this sort of thing than create it, and it's been being created for a while. 

And I believe that Mitt Romney will help the economy more than Obama has.

This isn't meant to be a flame war, just a debate. Naturally there will be disagreements.

CN12 wrote:

I have a few things that I saw in a flyer in the mail that I want to say:

President Obama believes government builds businesses and creates jobs, not people.
Not the job creators  and entreprenuers who pursued their dreams, took the risk, and put in the long hours starting and building their businesses.
Is this supposed to be a riff on the "you didn't build that" quote again? I hate how the Romney campaign talks about entrepreneurship. They talk about it as if everyone in America could quit their job right now and become a successful and rich businessperson, and if they don't and are poor it's their fault. Are you uneducated because your schools were underfunded? Good luck running a business. Are you poor at the moment? Unless you intend to go into software, you won't have any capital to start a business. And there is no way that everyone in America can get an idea and pursue it for a profit.
President Obama says the private sector is doing fine.
Unemployment is up. The national debt is higher. The number of Americans on food stamps and in poverty is higher.
The private sector has nothing to do with unemployment or national debt. Corporate profits are still at record highs. The rich get richer, the poor get poorer.

Four years ago, President Obama promised to create millions of new jobs and lead to America's economic recovery.
America is still waiting.
The president can't unilaterally make laws. That is the entire principle of the nation. If the Congress doesn't pass Obama's plans, we can't say anything about what his policy will do.
These were from a flyer in the mail, so I didn't actually come up with it.

Please don't start a flamewar about this.
Thank you.

veggieman001 wrote:

CN12 wrote:

President Obama believes government builds businesses and creates jobs, not people.
Not the job creators  and entreprenuers who pursued their dreams, took the risk, and put in the long hours starting and building their businesses.

do you have sources that prove this is true

It's not supposed to have a source, it's from a pro-Romney flyer he got in the mail.

CN12 wrote:

I have a few things that I saw in a flyer in the mail that I want to say:

President Obama believes government builds businesses and creates jobs, not people.
Not the job creators  and entreprenuers who pursued their dreams, took the risk, and put in the long hours starting and building their businesses.

There aren't too many middle class jobs to go around in the world, and a lot of them are with the government.

President Obama says the private sector is doing fine.
Unemployment is up. The national debt is higher. The number of Americans on food stamps and in poverty is higher.
Unemployment is now significantly lower. The debt is going up because Republicans in Congress refuse to cooperate on anything.

Four years ago, President Obama promised to create millions of new jobs and lead to America's economic recovery.
America is still waiting.

The economy has actually recovered significantly.

These were from a flyer in the mail, so I didn't actually come up with it.

Please don't start a flamewar about this.
Thank you.

Another thing. Romney's plan to cut the debt is this:
1. Cut taxes by 20% for everybody
2. Keep medicare and social security as they are for a while (he said "people retired or near retiring", which can mean over 10 years)
3. Give big tax breaks to companies and the upper class
4. Increase the size of the military by a lot

I also saw a video where Paul Ryan was asked for the math behind his reasoning about how his tax plan was "revenue neutral". He just kept saying it's "revenue neutral", and didn't say a single thing to justify it.

CheeseMunchy wrote:

jvvg wrote:

CN12 wrote:

I have a few things that I saw in a flyer in the mail that I want to say:

President Obama believes government builds businesses and creates jobs, not people.
Not the job creators  and entreprenuers who pursued their dreams, took the risk, and put in the long hours starting and building their businesses.

There aren't too many middle class jobs to go around in the world, and a lot of them are with the government.

President Obama says the private sector is doing fine.
Unemployment is up. The national debt is higher. The number of Americans on food stamps and in poverty is higher.
Unemployment is now significantly lower. The debt is going up because Republicans in Congress refuse to cooperate on anything.

Four years ago, President Obama promised to create millions of new jobs and lead to America's economic recovery.
America is still waiting.

The economy has actually recovered significantly.

These were from a flyer in the mail, so I didn't actually come up with it.

Please don't start a flamewar about this.
Thank you.

Another thing. Romney's plan to cut the debt is this:
1. Cut taxes by 20% for everybody
2. Keep medicare and social security as they are for a while (he said "people retired or near retiring", which can mean over 10 years)
3. Give big tax breaks to companies and the upper class
4. Increase the size of the military by a lot

I also saw a video where Paul Ryan was asked for the math behind his reasoning about how his tax plan was "revenue neutral". He just kept saying it's "revenue neutral", and didn't say a single thing to justify it.

Get that from a flyer in the mail? 

I've received tons of Obama and Romney fliers in the mail. The Obama ones are asking for money (since my parents are registered Democrats) and the Romney ones are asking for our vote (same reason).

Last edited by jvvg (2012-10-10 21:21:26)

CN12 wrote:

I have a few things that I saw in a flyer in the mail that I want to say:

President Obama believes government builds businesses and creates jobs, not people.
Not the job creators  and entreprenuers who pursued their dreams, took the risk, and put in the long hours starting and building their businesses.

no
the government has the duty of fixing the debt, teaching people and creating jobs

CN12 wrote:

President Obama says the private sector is doing fine.
Unemployment is up. The national debt is higher. The number of Americans on food stamps and in poverty is higher.

i don't actually see how he can affect it but okay the private sector is making more profit anyway

CN12 wrote:

Four years ago, President Obama promised to create millions of new jobs and lead to America's economic recovery.
America is still waiting.

and not much can be done in four years!! however he has created four million new jobs and that's millions right or my maths has gone all weird!!

OverPowered wrote:

The United States lost an approximate 8 million jobs from the late 2000s economic recession. After the end of the recession, 4 million jobs were created, with a net gain of 125,000 jobs after 2008. These are lower-wage and often underemployed jobs, but I hope you'll realise that people really want to work, even if it means being underemployed. People aren't just "moochers", but instead really benefit from programs like food stamps and other social safety nets.

Un-biased source needed.

soupoftomato wrote:

laptop97 wrote:

OverPowered wrote:

The United States lost an approximate 8 million jobs from the late 2000s economic recession. After the end of the recession, 4 million jobs were created, with a net gain of 125,000 jobs after 2008. These are lower-wage and often underemployed jobs, but I hope you'll realise that people really want to work, even if it means being underemployed. People aren't just "moochers", but instead really benefit from programs like food stamps and other social safety nets.

Un-biased source needed.

This source makes it look like Obama caused the recession, but as you can see, the large spike starts in 2008 (under Bush) rising higher than it had been in a while, it continues to rise for about a fourth of the first year Obama was in office (this is probably due to the inheritance of a poor economy, he wouldn't have had time to fix things yet) then the numbers start to go down again, after Obama has had time to take action.
http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

No... Obama raised unemployment by a lot and lowered it by a little. The unemployment rate is worse than when Bush was in office.

laptop97 wrote:

soupoftomato wrote:

laptop97 wrote:

Un-biased source needed.

This source makes it look like Obama caused the recession, but as you can see, the large spike starts in 2008 (under Bush) rising higher than it had been in a while, it continues to rise for about a fourth of the first year Obama was in office (this is probably due to the inheritance of a poor economy, he wouldn't have had time to fix things yet) then the numbers start to go down again, after Obama has had time to take action.
http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

No... Obama raised unemployment by a lot and lowered it by a little. The unemployment rate is worse than when Bush was in office.

It is unarguable that unemployment has gone down since 2010.  What is up for debate is how much the economic crash was due to Bush's policies, and whether any of Obama's policies either a) had significant impact before 2010 and b) whether that impact was positive or negative.

I'm not an economics expert, but I was under the impression that non-stock-market based crashes (e.g. the housing-market crash) take longer to rebound; furthermore, given the severity of the crash (greatest since the Great Depression), I wouldn't say that our current rate of recovery is that bad.

16Skittles wrote:

laptop97 wrote:

soupoftomato wrote:

This source makes it look like Obama caused the recession, but as you can see, the large spike starts in 2008 (under Bush) rising higher than it had been in a while, it continues to rise for about a fourth of the first year Obama was in office (this is probably due to the inheritance of a poor economy, he wouldn't have had time to fix things yet) then the numbers start to go down again, after Obama has had time to take action.
http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000

No... Obama raised unemployment by a lot and lowered it by a little. The unemployment rate is worse than when Bush was in office.

Things in a complex economy don't happen overnight. Nobody can really expect for unemployment to go down the day he takes office; it isn't as though the recession could only be during the Bush presidency. By that trend, unemployment is lower than it was when Obama took office. Bush started the crash, Obama slowed it, and at the current trend we'd be back at early Bush presidency unemployment levels of 6%, faster if Congress actually passed Obama's plans.

Unemployment is actually not at 8%. If you include all the people who are underemployed, or stopped looking for a job, that number goes up to about 14%.

My source? The Schnitt Show.